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Goodmorgan

Newbie question about roles in TSW...

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Goodmorgan    9

Hi, two quick newbie questions:

1. Are there more roles than tank, healer and dps (e.g. crowd control) in TSW? 

2. Is there any role that is played less/more or is it fairly balanced?

Thanks.

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Vikestart    106

1. There's only 3 main roles: Tank, Healer and DPS, but there are many varieties of these.

Tank

  • Heavy tanking (more survivability, less damage)
  • DPS tanking (more damage)
  • Buff tanking (Discord Rising and Short Fuse)
  • Heal-tanking (no need for a healer to heal you, but you don't do much damage).

DPS

  • DABS: Means slotting Breaching Shot and Deadly Aim to buff the entire group.
  • Impair DPS: In certain Nightmare dungeons like Hell Fallen, it's common to have one DPS handling impairs (crowd control).

Healing

  • Pure healing, which includes Blood and/or Fist healing, is stronger when it comes to healing output.
  • Leeching. When leeching, you can put up a decent amount of damage as well.

And that's just some of the subtypes. There are many variations :P

2. DPS is the most common role, probably because you can be lazy, and everyone likes to blame the tank or the healer for things..... 9_9 It can sometimes be hard to find a tank for a dungeon run.

Edited by Vikestart
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Goodmorgan    9

Thank you! That was quick!

Doing damage as a healer, or more damage as a tank sounds great!

It's fairly common in MMOs I guess, if the tank dies first it's the healers fault, and if the healer dies first it's the tanks fault, and if god forbid a DPS dies you never hear the end of it. :P

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albahtar    35

 if god forbid a DPS dies you never hear the end of it. :P

​Not everywhere, e.g. as a tank, I had more than once to kill the 5th Polaris boss alone with the healer, and the DPSs where shamefully silent at the well. Also 5th in Darkness War can be the same thing... xD

So much lazy/shy/not very confident people never do anything else than DPS, it is a shame really.

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Goodmorgan    9

​Not everywhere, e.g. as a tank, I had more than once to kill the 5th Polaris boss alone with the healer, and the DPSs where shamefully silent at the well. Also 5th in Darkness War can be the same thing... xD

So much lazy/shy/not very confident people never do anything else than DPS, it is a shame really.​

 

Well I guess the reason for it is simply that if a DPS makes a mistake the show can still go on (sometimes), but if a tank or healer makes a mistake the situation is more dire. :ph34r:

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DarkMoonrise    17

​Not everywhere, e.g. as a tank, I had more than once to kill the 5th Polaris boss alone with the healer

​Then the heal/leech isn't doing his job well. She/he need to slot SoH and kite the mini-squid and the bombs while DPS stand on the left and Tank on the right of the maxi-squid.

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Shivvies    59

Even though that is a common strat, DPS tend to die at Pol5, especially if they are not yet comfortable with the tank (ie. they don't know them) and a PDZ is impaired fırther into the cast.

I have seen perfectly executed rotas and impairs with very good leeches/healers still resulting in imagined "oh shit" moments for the DPS ending in deep calling :D

Re the OP, names are the same but sometimes the way they work are different than a lot of other mmos out there. Even vanilla, tanky tank needs to do some damage to keep doing their job for instance and there are varied ways to do one or several jobs, mostly made possible with improving gear and stat budget later in the game. Leech tanking, for instance, very gear dependent and a "oh wow, good thinking" kind of tanking.

These usually happen with groups who know each other though, with maybe 2-3 core members. With PUGs (Pick Up Groups) you usually expect a traditional tanky tank, a healer or a leecher and three pure DPS.

Fights in this game are usually knowledge games (with some requiring good skill, sometimes from the tank, sometimes the other roles) so very different from other MMOs, if a DPS dies to deep calling without any missed impairs, they only have themselves to blame - similarly, tank killing themselves to a demolish by the Machine Tyrant would be considered to just have done that, ie. kill themselves :D

There are certain "common strategies" which usually need to be cleared before each combat especially in PUGs - so rather than blaming each other, people usually know their part in the strategy and if they fail doing their part, there is (usually) no question about whose fault who died.

I even tell people to "stack on my builder aoe or expect to be brutally murdered by demonic Mayans" in DW1 - as really, a lot of groups do things differently and they become a part of your muscle memory. Usually, communication sorts out the blame game in this game and a usually more mature player base makes it much, much easier ;)

Cheers...

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Pclav    33
 

It's fairly common in MMOs I guess, if the tank dies first it's the healers fault, and if the healer dies first it's the tanks fault, and if god forbid a DPS dies you never hear the end of it. :P

Well I guess the reason for it is simply that if a DPS makes a mistake the show can still go on (sometimes), but if a tank or healer makes a mistake the situation is more dire. :ph34r:

Those general statements will get revised in TSW pretty quick ^^

You won't see it on normal or elite mode dungeons but on Nightmare mode some bosses have a one shot, one kill mechanic. If the tank doesn't stop [impair] the cast of those abilities he dies.

TSW has no umm.. pure? direct? agro abilities. How much agro you generate is purely based on your damage. There are actives that deal extra agro and a passive that multiplies that, but by the end of the day it's your base damage as a tank that counts for you agro output.

That's something that I haven't seen in any other MMO and I know some people are very suprized by that. With TSWs "can't have all the stats" approach you have to find your sweetspot between HP and DPS talis as a tank. Then that get's revised by how good your healer and dps are ;)

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Vikestart    106

​TSW has no umm.. pure? direct? agro abilities. How much agro you generate is purely based on your damage. There are actives that deal extra agro and a passive that multiplies that, but by the end of the day it's your base damage as a tank that counts for you agro output.

​Other MMOs have pure aggro abilities that one uses in their rotation? O.o That sounds weird.

There are a couple of pure aggro abilities in TSW, but they have long cooldowns. Those are Confuse, Mass Confusion, Provoke and Mass Provocation. So those can only be used for emergencies or for special occassions, like DW6, to interrupt a dangerous abilitiy that can't be impaired.

There's also the Misdirection ability, which I think a lot of people underestimate. It's a lot more efficient for 1 DPS to slot Misdirection and use that if the tank has aggro issues, rather than all the DPS slotting the Sublety passive. :)

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Shivvies    59

Misdirection can be really good under certain circumstances. Usually not worth the slot but sometimes you kind of have to have some stuff there - like, never seen a tank compliaining about Agitator taking up one slot :P

Also, yeah, in most of the class based mmo's you might not have an aggro active in your rotation but a TANK class will have aggro no matter how much damage they do as it is their "role" :D Not in this game. Also it is fairly common for people to play any role after a while - even Shivvies McNooberton can do rDPS, mDPS, Tank and to an extent Leech (with healtank coming soonTM and fist heal as necessary using drops).

Cheers...

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